VCE English Question Thread

[paper-back]

How do you thoroughly explain and discuss evidence? I often find that my 'explanation' sentences are too short and when I do try to expand upon my explanations; my sentences become very repetitive

Thanks

[tashhhaaa]

Dw, I shamelessly stalk all Lauren's posts
... and feel free to ask any questions directly !

will do next time, thank you! 

[literally lauren]

...she'll contradict me when I'm wrong...

There is no "wrong" in English

Well, there kind of is, but it's not like you're telling everyone to avoid reading their texts to avoid spoilers, or that they should spice up their essays by writing a paragraph in hieroglyphs or anything 

In all honesty though, I'd absolutely agree that it's worth trying these sorts of ideas without too much fear of an assessor's reaction. You'd just have to be careful not to stick to stringently to a single method of writing when you know it's kinda risky.

Keeping Context essays interesting is definitely a worthy challenge though, so any attempts to invigorate things whilst still hitting all the important criteria will be much appreciated, I'm sure

I care about my score but I think I'm more afraid of boring my assessor than shocking them tbh...

It's probably better to fall on the side of caution than to deliberately "WOW" them with some never-before-seen insight into Identity and Belonging. That's not to say your piece shouldn't be interesting to read and write - if you can engage with the material and produce something that responds to the prompt in a creative and insightful way, then that's absolutely awesome.

But that's the trick - something that responds to the prompt - that's the core of the task that people often lose sight of in their quest to write what they want to write.

When it comes to practice, work on things from heaps of different angles. You can even go out of your way to choose a prompt that lets you construct the kind of piece you want to write. (Hell, I think I even wrote a few Conflict prompts in Yr 12 just so I could use certain examples or bookends )

Depending on how easy you find creative writing, you might be fine going into the exam with a few options up your sleeve and a confidence in your ability to mould what you know to suit the prompt you're given. Or you may find that responding to a prompt in timed conditions is simply easier from an expository/hybrid perspective (...not that that's some indisputable fact; it's totally dependent on what kind of writer you are!) But planning or writing a piece now doesn't lock you into anything, so do all the experimentation you need before settling on a method with which you're comfortable

After reading the book several times, and I have completed all comprehension questions, what do I do now? (text response essay in 3 weeks)

If you feel like you need to do more reading of study guides or from the text in order to consolidate your knowledge, then do so. Otherwise, you're probably ready to start writing.

That doesn't mean you have to jump into writing essays, though. I usually recommend people just write some very general (almost non-Text Response-y) paragraphs about certain characters or themes. For instance, if you're studying Maus, (which I think you are, if I'm remembering a few pages of this thread ago correctly) then you could try writing a few hundred words about the character of Vladek. What are some of the important events that he experiences? What are his motivations or values? Do we sympathise with him? Next you might consider a certain theme, like 'suffering.' What does suffering look like in the text? Do characters suffer in different ways, or for different reasons? What is Spiegelman saying about the concept of suffering?

The writing that you'll be doing here isn't what you'll be writing in your SAC/the exam, per se; it's just to get your brain thinking about how you can connect important parts of the text. Later you'll start to do this in a more structured way, and eventually you'll be able to face the ultimate challenge - applying this knowledge to set prompts.

How do you thoroughly explain and discuss evidence? I often find that my 'explanation' sentences are too short and when I do try to expand upon my explanations; my sentences become very repetitive

Thanks

Which essay type(s) would this apply to? Or could you give us an example of the kinds of too short and/or repetitive sentences that you're writing?

[paper-back]

Text response

For example; the prompt: "Ordinary people with ordinary emotions, like the chorus, are often caught between sympathy towards, and horror at Medea's actions"

I'd get evidence that shows the chorus showing sympathy, but then I'd just be like "So this demonstrates that the chorus show's sympathy towards Medea's actions" without being able to thoroughly explain/discuss the significance of the quote and I end up with a paragraph that consists of the same re-phrased sentence throughout

[lisax3]

How would I improve my sentence structure? Whenever I'm writing essays my sentences seem to be too "clunky"?

[cameotodd]

Guys what is a 7/10 on an exam considered to be? (lower part of the upper range, mid range etc.)
and what study score do would three 7's net you in the end of year exam?

[_fruitcake_]

Guys what is a 7/10 on an exam considered to be? (lower part of the upper range, mid range etc.)
and what study score do would three 7's net you in the end of year exam?

7/10 for exam is considered a 42/60 which is a low A.

GA1 - 70% = mid B+
GA2 - 70%= mid B+
GA3 - 70%= 42/60 in the exam is a low A

This would net u 34-37 depending on other factors.. if sacs scale down or up and rank as well

[cameotodd]

7/10 for exam is considered a 42/60 which is a low A.

GA1 - 70% = mid B+
GA2 - 70%= mid B+
GA3 - 70%= 42/60 in the exam is a low A

This would net u 34-37 depending on other factors.. if sacs scale down or up and rank as well

What about: GA1 - 89% (this is what I got in unit 3)
GA2 - 85% (prediction for unit 4)
Exam - 42/60

[cosine]

Guys how hard is it to get 8/10 in the exam for english on all three sections? What about 7/10?

[appleandbee]

Guys how hard is it to get 8/10 in the exam for english on all three sections? What about 7/10?

It hard to judge difficulty, as it varies from person to person. I'd say for an above average English student (as least in the context of VCE), 8/10 on all sections is pretty achievable (this judgement is based on the fact that I’m in an above average English cohort where around 70% of students get 40+), so you definitely don’t need to be a top student to get 8/10 essays. Your essays don’t need to be flawless either, as there is a significant difference between an 8/10 and 10/10 essay.  To put it in perspective though, 8-9% of the state will get an A+ on the English exam (total equivalent of 8/10 on all three sections. 7/10 is more achievable where around 20% of the state will get at least that.

[heids]

Text response

For example; the prompt: "Ordinary people with ordinary emotions, like the chorus, are often caught between sympathy towards, and horror at Medea's actions"

I'd get evidence that shows the chorus showing sympathy, but then I'd just be like "So this demonstrates that the chorus show's sympathy towards Medea's actions" without being able to thoroughly explain/discuss the significance of the quote and I end up with a paragraph that consists of the same re-phrased sentence throughout

Hoping Lauren will help me out here, a question I've often wanted to ask!

My best guess is that you need to spend some time developing more complex ideas.  If you have a paragraph with the sole argument of "the chorus shows sympathy towards Medea's actions", of course you're going to keep repeating it because you don't have anywhere further to go.

If you spend more time questioning the prompt, however, e.g.:
> what are 'ordinary people' and 'ordinary emotions'? in what way is the chorus 'ordinary'?
> are there other 'ordinary' characters? is the chorus 'ordinary' in contrast to other characters?
> is it different for other non/un/in-ordinary characters? do they have different feelings about her actions?
> do her actions evoke both sympathy and horror at once, or do some evoke sympathy and some other ones horror?
> ... etc.

then you might end up with paragraphs with more complex/broad focuses, rather than ones just trying to prove one narrow point.  If you have more than just one thing to say, you'll inevitably repeat yourself less.

And please don't put an apostrophe in 'shows', it hurts me

How would I improve my sentence structure? Whenever I'm writing essays my sentences seem to be too "clunky"?

Firstly: do you recognise their clunkiness, or need someone to point it out to you?

If you recognise it, great!  If you read a clunky sentence you've written, it's often just a matter of twisting and rearranging it in your mind until it sounds/feels 'right'.  Try asking yourself, 'What am I actually trying to say?'  Then, in really basic conversational English, verbally explain what your point is - that often makes it easier to make a good, clear, sophisticated, written sentences.  As long as you can pick your problems, you can generally sort them out (with some time and thought).

If you don't, get someone to sit down with you and highlight where you're going wrong with one of your essays.  If you don't recognise there's something wrong even when they point it out, you'll need them to explain the basic grammar rules.  Then, practise writing sentences of the same type, and get them to check that you've got the grammar right in those sentences too.

But most important: what exactly is 'clunky' about them?  Commas in the wrong spots?  Poor subject-verb agreement?  Run-on or fragmented sentences?  Using vocab incorrectly?  Short, choppy sentences?  Can you find types of sentences that you commonly make a mess off?  If you find specific weaknesses, then you can focus on avoiding them in all your prac pieces, or write lots of prac sentences of this type.

But remember, in the end, assessors realise that you're writing a 'first-draft' piece and don't expect a polished, beautiful piece.

[tashhhaaa]

hey y'all

are we allowed to use old VCAA texts as supplementary texts for context pieces?

I was thinking of writing an expository essay sometime soon using one of my school texts as well as an old Whose Reality text (however my context is ID&B)

if I can make it work would this be ok?

[paper-back]

Hoping Lauren will help me out here, a question I've often wanted to ask!

My best guess is that you need to spend some time developing more complex ideas.  If you have a paragraph with the sole argument of "the chorus shows sympathy towards Medea's actions", of course you're going to keep repeating it because you don't have anywhere further to go.

If you spend more time questioning the prompt, however, e.g.:
> what are 'ordinary people' and 'ordinary emotions'? in what way is the chorus 'ordinary'?
> are there other 'ordinary' characters? is the chorus 'ordinary' in contrast to other characters?
> is it different for other non/un/in-ordinary characters? do they have different feelings about her actions?
> do her actions evoke both sympathy and horror at once, or do some evoke sympathy and some other ones horror?
> ... etc.

then you might end up with paragraphs with more complex/broad focuses, rather than ones just trying to prove one narrow point.  If you have more than just one thing to say, you'll inevitably repeat yourself less.

And please don't put an apostrophe in 'shows', it hurts me

Thanks for the response bangali_lok! Sorry about the "shows", I've been unconsciously abusing the use of apostrophes in my sentences when typing since recently

Do I directly answer a question such as "what are 'ordinary people' and 'ordinary emotions'?" in a paragraph?
I'm worried that I might stray away from the prompt through asking/answering questions such as this

[Adequace]

Hey,

At school we're going to start learning how to write comparative essays to prepare for the upcoming study design changes. I'm quite ignorant on how to write a comparative essay, so if someone could enlighten me on the basics, that would be appreciated 

[literally lauren]

Text response

For example; the prompt: "Ordinary people with ordinary emotions, like the chorus, are often caught between sympathy towards, and horror at Medea's actions"

I'd get evidence that shows the chorus showing sympathy, but then I'd just be like "So this demonstrates that the chorus show's sympathy towards Medea's actions" without being able to thoroughly explain/discuss the significance of the quote and I end up with a paragraph that consists of the same re-phrased sentence throughout

To add to what bangali lok said, try asking these two questions:

   1. How do I know?
   2. Why is this significant?
(preferably in that order)
So in this case, if you have a piece of evidence that you think demonstrates the Chorus' sympathy towards Medea, start by outlining that evidence but then force yourself to be specific - how do you know they're demonstrating sympathy? It's not like they ever say 'Gee, poor old Medea, we sure do feel sympathetic towards her' and Euripides never includes a stage direction like [cue sympathetic sighs from the Chorus.] You've gotten that impression from the text somehow, so show your workings.
Then you start building back out again by asking what the point of this is. Why does this matter? What effect does it have on our view of the text? Or in this case - why do they feel sympathy? Saying 'they're sympathetic' without providing any reasons or interpretations can't get you far, so thinking about the bigger picture and 'zooming-out' can help immensely.

Assuming this was just one of the examples you'd use in your essay, the stuff mentioned above should be fine, but if you were trying to write a whole paragraph based around that one point, then you might be having a different problem. The sentence 'The Chorus feels sympathy towards Medea' is a point of evidence, not an idea - so if that was your focus for a whole paragraph, it's only natural for you to run out of things to say. So rather than breaking up a prompt into three/four different pieces of evidence, you could instead try to find three or four core ideas that are based on the ideas in the prompt, not just the key words it uses.

eg. the core of this prompt isn't just 'ordinary,' 'sympathy,' and 'horror' - it's that we cannot decide whether Medea is sympathetic or horrific. The point is that we're torn between those two extremes and don't know if her actions are justified. Yes, you'll talk about those key words in the bulk of your discussion, but the structure of your essay (the backbone of the skeleton, if you will) has to come from the core of the prompt. Only then can you 'flesh it out' to form the full body of your essay

hey y'all

are we allowed to use old VCAA texts as supplementary texts for context pieces?

I was thinking of writing an expository essay sometime soon using one of my school texts as well as an old Whose Reality text (however my context is ID&B)

if I can make it work would this be ok?

You can; just make absolutely sure that it's not on the current English list, or the current Lit. list either. If it is, the assessors are allowed to just cross out everything you've written on that text and only give you marks for what's left.

Even then, it can be worth researching some other examples to use instead since you'll have a chance to talk about something new in your piece, and assessor's who trek through hundreds of same-y essays usually appreciate that. But if you think a previous VCAA text demonstrates one of your key ideas really well, then you're free to use it.

Old school texts (eg. To Kill A Mockingbird or Macbeth or whatever people study in Year 9/10 etc.) are totally fine

Hey,

At school we're going to start learning how to write comparative essays to prepare for the upcoming study design changes. I'm quite ignorant on how to write a comparative essay, so if someone could enlighten me on the basics, that would be appreciated 

Ah, so this would be the entirely new essay style that VCAA has kindly given us very little information about :s
Usually I'm okay at decyphering the English Department's Study Designs, but I'm afraid until I've got a better idea what the actual task is about and what the criteria are, there's not much I can do to help, I'm afraid.

Based on what I know, you're studying two texts (right?) and then get given a prompt that you have to use to write about both of them?
eg. for Harry Potter and The Chronicles of Narnia
Prompt: Discuss the importance of friendship for the protagonists in the two texts.

I could be way off, so perhaps if you could let me know what your teacher/class are up to at the moment, I might be able to offer some advice as to how the comparison works. All I can say for the moment is it shouldn't be too separate... meaning you can't just have one paragraph on the first text, one on the second, and then a third para where you talk about them both. Instead, you'll be comparing them quite often, spending several sentences expanding on one idea and then transitioning to a relevant point in the other text.

At least that's how it is in other subjects with comparative tasks, and it's a format that I think enables you to write more sophisticated things, but for all I know, VCAA have gone in a totally different direction so... 

Any details you've got would be greatly appreciated since very few schools I know have received any info at all